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Asta Kask
Holy Cardinal and Five Star General of the Righteous Knighthood of Jabootu
Sweden
263 Posts |
 Posted - 01/18/2010 : 11:48:24 AM
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So... I went and saw it, and I'm in two minds about it.
First of all, it is technically amazing. The effects are largely excellent and they really build a world you can believe in. And there's one magnificent scene where [spoiler]the huge community tree the primitives live in[/spoiler] falls over.
But the story... oh, dear God in the skies above, the story. Imagine taking On Deadly Ground, Pocahontas, and the scenes where the Ewoks trounce the Stormtroopers and mixing it together. It is the most paint-by-numbers plot you can imagine. I don't think there's a single character in the movie who isn't a horrible cliché. And why make a three-hour long movie when anyone with half a mind can see the ending after ten minutes?
I'm not good at judging acting - I have a very large capability to suspend disbelief in that area - but I don't think they are very good either. Sigourney Weaver is far below her normal capacity, in my opinion.
- Who is John Galt? - |
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RossM
Holy Cardinal and Five Star General of the Righteous Knighthood of Jabootu
USA
427 Posts |
Posted - 01/18/2010 : 1:58:39 PM
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| dances with wolves comes to mind as well |
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BradH812
Holy Cardinal and Five Star General of the Righteous Knighthood of Jabootu
USA
1294 Posts |
Posted - 01/18/2010 : 9:18:55 PM
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I haven't seen Avatar, nor do I plan to. I've heard enough about it already. I saw Moon on Blu-Ray yesterday afternoon, and one thought came to my mind when it was over: which is more worth my time? A $240 million movie with $239,999,998 worth of effects and two bucks worth of script? Or a five-million dollar movie that had special effects making it look like it cost $50 million, excellent acting, and a smart story line that had me guessing right up to the end?
And the depressing thing is, Avatar now looks like the one to beat at the Oscars. I guess that nominate-ten-movies-so-we-won't-make-asses-out-ourselves-yet-again ploy of theirs isn't going to work. |
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Asta Kask
Holy Cardinal and Five Star General of the Righteous Knighthood of Jabootu
Sweden
263 Posts |
Posted - 01/19/2010 : 03:14:30 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by RossM
dances with wolves comes to mind as well
I may be the only person in the Western hemisphere who haven't seen that.
- Who is John Galt? - |
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RossM
Holy Cardinal and Five Star General of the Righteous Knighthood of Jabootu
USA
427 Posts |
Posted - 01/19/2010 : 09:55:55 AM
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| The concept of the "Noble savage" being contaminated by the evil greedy white west, has been popular with the "liberal progressives" for centuries. This, I believe explains at least in part their affection for outfits like the Khmer Rouge, the Talaban and Hamas. |
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Flangepart
Holy Cardinal and Five Star General of the Righteous Knighthood of Jabootu
USA
2329 Posts |
Posted - 01/19/2010 : 11:46:16 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by RossM
The concept of the "Noble savage" being contaminated by the evil greedy white west, has been popular with the "liberal progressives" for centuries. This, I believe explains at least in part their affection for outfits like the Khmer Rouge, the Talaban and Hamas.
Some years ago, I read a book by an anthropologist who questioned that concept, based on the materials excavated over the years.
A thing he pointed out, that many well used wepons were found in pre-european times settelments.
So my question, if tsome native tribes were such good fighters before the white guy arrived...who did they practice on?
"Vulcans : The designated drivers of the universe."
"Hoody Hoo, i waste 'em with my cross bow!" Bob Herzog- KODT
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Terrahawk
Holy Cardinal and Five Star General of the Righteous Knighthood of Jabootu
USA
644 Posts |
Posted - 01/19/2010 : 3:36:04 PM
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I'm with Brad and don't plan on seeing it. Might check it out on DVD once it hits NetFlix. I will say though that while I have problems with "Dances with Wolves", that film has to be far better in it's message than "Avatar." My biggest problem with DwW is that it took out one scene (the one showing what happened to the buffalo hunters) that would have balanced a lot of it's noble savage myth building. It did at least have another tribe that wasn't so pure. On the other hand, everything I hear about "Avatar" is that it is a ham-fisted political screed wrapped in an action film with spectacular graphics. I just don't need that.
I summon Bigger Fish! |
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Ericb
Holy Cardinal and Five Star General of the Righteous Knighthood of Jabootu
USA
648 Posts |
Posted - 01/20/2010 : 11:46:48 AM
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Satire - Plot of David Foster Wallace novel Infinite Jest via wikipedia: "The plot partially revolves around the missing master copy of a film cartridge, titled Infinite Jest and referred to in the novel as "the Entertainment" or "the samizdat". The film is so entertaining to its viewers that they become lifeless, losing all interest in anything other than viewing the film. "
Reality - Avatar fan site: http://www.avatar-forums.com/general-avatar-forum/43-ways-cope-depression-dream-pandora-being-intangible.html
"I used to be With IT. But then they changed what IT was. Now what I'm with isn't IT, and what's IT seems scary and wierd. It'll happen to YOU!" - Grandpa Simpson
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Ericb
Holy Cardinal and Five Star General of the Righteous Knighthood of Jabootu
USA
648 Posts |
Posted - 01/20/2010 : 12:08:43 PM
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I'd wager that few, if any, reputable anthropologists or archeologists buy into the "noble savage" myth anymore.
Just browse Amazon.com a little bit and it's easy to separate the wheat from the chaff and while their is plenty of New Ago Woo to be found on Native Americans there is also plenty of serious scholarship that lays the Woo to rest.
Also if anyone is interested in seeing film with a more sobering portrayal of Native Americans I'd recommend Black Robe.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Robe_(film)
"I used to be With IT. But then they changed what IT was. Now what I'm with isn't IT, and what's IT seems scary and wierd. It'll happen to YOU!" - Grandpa Simpson
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Terrahawk
Holy Cardinal and Five Star General of the Righteous Knighthood of Jabootu
USA
644 Posts |
Posted - 01/20/2010 : 7:45:54 PM
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Actually, I thought "Last of the Mohicans" did a good job of not having the Noble Savage myth.
Regrettably, serious scholarship usually gets drowned out by film ideology.
I summon Bigger Fish! |
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Flangepart
Holy Cardinal and Five Star General of the Righteous Knighthood of Jabootu
USA
2329 Posts |
Posted - 01/21/2010 : 07:50:29 AM
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Ah, the 'Man who shot Liberty Valance' line..."When the truth conflicts with the ledgend, print the ledgend"
"Vulcans : The designated drivers of the universe."
"Hoody Hoo, i waste 'em with my cross bow!" Bob Herzog- KODT
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BT
Preeminent Apostolic Prelate of the Discipleship of Jabootu
USA
168 Posts |
Posted - 01/21/2010 : 12:53:41 PM
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quote:
I haven't seen Avatar, nor do I plan to. I've heard enough about it already. I saw Moon on Blu-Ray yesterday afternoon, and one thought came to my mind when it was over: which is more worth my time? A $240 million movie with $239,999,998 worth of effects and two bucks worth of script? Or a five-million dollar movie that had special effects making it look like it cost $50 million, excellent acting, and a smart story line that had me guessing right up to the end?
I'd counter that there is value seeing a movie with 239,999,998 in effects while it's at theaters. I'd really like to see "Moon", but I have the rest of my life to see it on DVD. I won't have that opportunity soon with "Avatar". If the job of a movie is (among other things) to take you out of the theater, and show you things you've never seen before, "Avatar" passes that test with flying colors. I didn't like it as much as most people I know, and I have huge issues with some of the plot, but I'm very glad I saw it at the theater, and I might go see it again.
Can I just add that as someone who could be labeled as a "Liberal Progressive", I know of NO ONE who has an affection for the Khmer Rouge or the Taliban, and while I know some that might understand why Hamas has some issues with Israel, none of them condone, let alone have an affection for, their terrorist actions. |
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Ericb
Holy Cardinal and Five Star General of the Righteous Knighthood of Jabootu
USA
648 Posts |
Posted - 01/21/2010 : 4:01:28 PM
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Can I just add that as someone who could be labeled as a "Liberal Progressive", I know of NO ONE who has an affection for the Khmer Rouge or the Taliban
Nor have I, and that includes time in a Marxist infested English grad school dept.
"Marxism is the opiate of the grad student."
"I used to be With IT. But then they changed what IT was. Now what I'm with isn't IT, and what's IT seems scary and wierd. It'll happen to YOU!" - Grandpa Simpson
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zombiewhacker
Holy Cardinal and Five Star General of the Righteous Knighthood of Jabootu
USA
1475 Posts |
Posted - 01/21/2010 : 6:14:41 PM
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| Well, "liberal progressive" was in scare quotes, so maybe RossM was referring to people who aren't liberal progressives but only claimed to be. |
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BradH812
Holy Cardinal and Five Star General of the Righteous Knighthood of Jabootu
USA
1294 Posts |
Posted - 01/22/2010 : 05:32:39 AM
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| If Marxism is the opiate of the grad student, is Groucho Marxism the opiate of the wisecracker? |
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Neville
Holy Cardinal and Five Star General of the Righteous Knighthood of Jabootu
Spain
1590 Posts |
Posted - 01/22/2010 : 05:36:55 AM
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Can't believe so many of you are going to wait for the DVD just because Avatar is a tad too preachy. C'on, it's not like it's gonna make you a treehugger all of a sudden. It's not much worse than say Princess Mononoke, and I doubt it will look as great as it does in the big screen on a plasma TV.
I saw it in 2D a few weeks ago. And yes, most of the criticism is well justified. The story is cliché and it can get corny here and there, but it's a terrific popcorn film and the visuals alone are amazin.
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Edited by - Neville on 01/22/2010 06:11:46 AM |
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